Sideline Sessions

Ross Romano: [00:00:00] Welcome in everybody to Sideline Sessions here on the Be Podcast Network. Thanks as always for being with us, and it's my pleasure to bring you another great guest in an episode that. [00:01:00] I think we'll touch on many of the topics that you're finding interesting and valuable.

My guest today is coach Jennifer Gross. She enters her 14th year as the head coach at the University of California Davis Aggies women's basketball team. UC Davis is a special place for Gross. She was a point guard for the program from 1993 to 97 before returning as an assistant coach in 2004. Then eventually of course, taking over as head coach.

She led the Aggies to five straight Big West Conference, regular season titles from 2017 to 21, and during her time as both an assistant and head coach, the team has reached three NCAA Division one tournaments, five appearances in the WNIT, including a trip to the I Elite eight of the WNIT in 2018. We're going to discuss.

This team success that I just referenced, the strong team culture Jennifer has built, the program's core values, relationships with student athletes, and a lot more. Jennifer, welcome to the [00:02:00] show.

Jennifer Gross: Thanks for having me, Ross. It's a pleasure to be here.

Ross Romano: Yeah, it's a real pleasure to have you, and one of the things I wanted to start with, and I think it's particularly interesting because you've seen it From both sides of the D2, D1 kind of piece there as when you played at UC Davis, the, the school's competing in division two level. And then when you joined as an assistant coach, it was, I think, during the first or second year when the program was moving to D1 and, you know, I think those are the kind of things, right, that a lot of our high school student athletes, their parents, their coaches are, you know, trying to figure out how to navigate.

What's the differences between these levels? What's going to be the best fit for me? What are some of the things to know and be aware of? So I'm interested in, from your perspective, what are, if any, any, you know, the bigger differences, the changes that you experience being on both sides of that, anything that's Useful for a prospective student [00:03:00] athlete to know as they're looking at what some of the different programs are that are available to them.

Jennifer Gross: Yeah, yeah, definitely. So, you know, my answer to this is probably different than it was a year ago, and it's different than it was you know, five years ago in terms of just straight, what is the collegiate athletic landscape look like these days? But kind of at the core of my answer, it'll still remain the same, and that's basically if you're a, A high school player that wants to play at the collegiate level.

I encourage players to just find the right fit for them. You know, don't, so many people get caught getting hung up in the level, you know, I want to play D1, you know. Hey, I was a Division II athlete that competed for a national championship and had the best experience of my life. So, I can easily tell people, go where You can have a tremendous experience where you [00:04:00] can accomplish all your goals, where you can be around great people.

Now having said that, there, you know, things are changing for sure. So, you know, a, a law just got passed, you know, last week that says now universities can, can pay players directly. So, so previ prior to that, it was, you know, where you have to go through a collective with the NIL, you have to go through a collective with the NIL.

Deals and whatnot. So that's changing. So even in just the past couple months, you know, players are now being offered money in different capacities. And so that's factoring into decision making. You know, conferences are changing. You have a conference like the Pac 12 that had, you know, storied, storied conference with, with year, you know, decades of tradition that is no longer in existence now.

So, on the West Coast, that was kind of the, the Power 5 conference that a lot of student athletes were striving for. And so, a lot of changes you know, and definitely [00:05:00] interesting to navigate for all of us, but at the end of the day, I, I think I do go back to, You know, find a place that where, if you, if you are passionate about a sport where you really can, can see yourself thriving where you feel like the coaches are going to be great mentors for you, where the teammates are going to be You know, potentially lifelong friends where, you know, you can get a great degree and if you kind of stick with those things, I think the experience will, will be a positive one.

That's, that's kind of my advice, I guess. (ad here)

Ross Romano: And, and a, a lot of those changes that you referenced with respect to NIL and and the transfer portal. Right. And, and how how some of the rule changes are shifting. You know, what, what. Athletes need to be aware of coaches, what coaches and programs are focusing on, how it affects [00:06:00] recruiting, and also what opportunities are available to student athletes.

They're shifting the landscape across a lot of college sports, and You're also, it's a really interesting time, I think, for a lot of those things to be happening specific to women's college basketball because there has been over the past handful of years a lot of, growing attention, I think, on the sport, on some of the high profile athletes that are playing it, some of the really successful programs, and, and that has grown.

I don't know how much, right, there's probably a certain amount of that, that you feel when you're, when you're coaching in the sport. Of course, a lot of it you've been immersed in, in the sport for a long time, right, so your attention's always been there but that's. likely something that is going to change [00:07:00] what a lot of those, especially with the, the money piece, what that means for student athletes who are going to play basketball, that it might've been different if it was happening 10 years ago, 20 years ago, where There was a narrower focus for where a lot of the money was going in college sports, men's football, or, you know, men's basketball, maybe, you know, some of it went to some other sports, but and, and I think it's not, it's not exclusively, I think a lot of women's sports are having a lot more positive attention and media coverage lately.

I think even, even on the men's side, there's, some sports outside of the traditional few that are starting to have, you know, more of a fan base and more attention given to them. But yeah, I'm curious from your perspective what it's like for all of that to be happening at the same time, [00:08:00] right? When you're, I'm sure you and your staff are learning these rules as they're being passed, right?

And you're learning, okay, what can we do? What, what do we need to be paying attention to here? And also what are, you know, what is the flood of information that's being presented to our recruits and our athletes as, as these things are changing and schools are approaching them in different ways that a few years ago was, was not the way things were,

Jennifer Gross: Sure. Yeah. Well, I'll start with You know, kind of the general interest and excitement around women's basketball, you know, I, I tell our team right now, you know, just that they are really fortunate to be playing at a time where excitement for women's basketball is at an all time high. You know, obviously, you know, players like Caitlin Clark and Angel Reese and Juju Watkins and, you know, LIS could go on and on, but I think there were [00:09:00] so many exciting storylines in the Women's NCAA Tournament this year, and obviously the numbers the viewership was incredible, kind of, a number of the games outperformed the, the men's games in terms of viewership, so.

That is trickling down, you know, so we're in a town Davis, California, where we have about 65, 000 residents, a lot of those are students, but I mean, the numbers for our games are seeing increases as well you know, our camp, our girls camp sold out in two days this year. You know, we, we have parents wanting to start club programs for younger kids.

So kids are, you know, girls in particular, but the kids in general are just, you know, really supportive and excited about women's basketball. So it's fun, you know, in that sense, I love it. I love that our games are drawing more people that, You know, when we go on the road, you know, we have friends and families that say, Hey, we're tuned in, you know, they're, they're following on [00:10:00] ESPN, which is exciting.

So in that sense, I think it's a really exciting time to be both playing and coaching the sport. In terms of sort of the changes at the collegiate level, yeah, there, there's a lot. I think that, you know, You know, we have players that are being offered NIL deals and we're navigating that. We have agents coming in the mix, you know, where it used to be once you finished your, your eligibility, then you could get set up with an agent and look at playing professionally.

But now these agents are, are reaching out to them when they're in high school. And so the parents are calling us to say, Hey, You know, do you know these people, or what, what am I allowed to do? What am I not allowed to do? Which, some of them are asking, which is great, some of them aren't, and trying to navigate it on their own, which, you know, is, is challenging.

You have schools that are just straight up offering money to kids, you know, and so that's something new that is going to be allowed here, and, and through [00:11:00] NIL has, You know, sort of taken over a little bit players are, are hearing what other players are making, you know, and it's obviously vastly different on from men to women, from mid major to power five.

And so, you know, there used to be at a, at a mid major program, there were things that you just kind of didn't have to. Maybe, I don't know, deal with is the right term, but you didn't have to worry about, you know, it was sort of just, you know, that those conversations weren't coming up and now they're definitely coming up.

And so, you know, it's time to get creative. A lot of coaches that I talked to are saying, well, this isn't what I signed up for. And, you know, it's, this is, the whole landscape has changed and I don't know how do we, and the reality is it is what it is, you know, and, and as a collegiate coach, you sort of have to.

Lean into it a bit and, you know, try to help the student athletes as best they can, you know, for me, I'm As long, you know, [00:12:00] as long as we continue to have conversations about how important the team is and the team culture is, I still feel like individuals can shine within that. You're seeing that again across the country with the spotlight being on a number of individual players.

And yet those players are on teams that have been very successful, so they're finding a way to kind of balance that. So, so yeah, I think as coaches we have to learn quickly as much as we can so that we can help our student athletes utilize the resources the best they can try to help themselves, try to Assist them and guide them so they're, they're not making too, you know, mistakes on their own.

But, but yeah, I think it's a changing time and we all have to kind of lean in and just figure out how to best navigate things. You know, for, for us in recruiting it, we've always been about recruiting team first people. So we have to make sure that we're still staying true to to our identity and, and recruiting the right people in the right fit [00:13:00] but I think you can do that and still talk about how to, you know, help individuals maximize their, their name, image, and likeness and, and try to, they're in a time where.

Hey, it's allowed for you to do that. So let's help you do that in, in the most productive way possible.

Ross Romano: Right. Yeah. And in some of the things you referenced there, particularly asking the right questions, right? Like making sure you have a good understanding of what the rules are, what the opportunities are because coaches, and I definitely want to get into the program you've built because my belief is that once some of the short term upheaval of there's a lot of change and we're all kind of figuring that out, or, or there's different factors that, that are, driving decisions, right?

Once that kind of settles down and the, the new landscape becomes the status quo, that the programs that are the strongest, that have a culture, that have an idea [00:14:00] of, of what they've built, who should be in that, and that players want to be a part of that, that's what's going to be sustained. But as you mentioned, you know, there's, I mean, for, it's, it's, for a lot of college student athletes, this is a great opportunity for them to, to maximize their value and and it's great for them to be able to do that as well.

But I do want to talk about your program and particularly, you know, as I kind of referenced in the opening, right? It's a program you've been a part of for a long time, first as a player, then as an assistant coach for a number of years before becoming that coach. And so I'm sure you had You know, certainly the experience of. been a part of the program as it existed and then also had things that [00:15:00] you wanted it to represent, you wanted to build on your own once you were in the head job. What, what was that transition like for you going from you know, and I, and I believe if I'm not mistaken, but you can, you can correct this, that that you were an assistant for a coach that you had played for, for at least part of your career too.

So, you know, so, so, you know, a program, of course, that I'm sure you had a great understanding and a contribution to building the culture that existed, but then also things that I'm sure that you wanted to develop in new ways. You know, as you've been the head coach now for, for quite a while as well.

So, yeah, what, what's that transition like and that, that process of building a program, not coming from the outside, right, and, and starting over from scratch, but developing and iterating and, and trying to enhance something that you were a part of you know, already.

Jennifer Gross: Yeah. So UC Davis has kind of an [00:16:00] interesting, unique history within the coaching staff. So, you know, the first coach, her name was Pam Gilfisher. She was really instrumental during the title nine era of, of not just for women's basketball at Davis, but just in general of, of really, you know, Enhancing opportunities for women across the country, but she was a, a main voice and, and a tremendous coach here at UC Davis.

And the, the, the guy that I played for, his name is Sandy Simpson. He actually was a student assistant to Pam. And when Pam retired, she hired a woman named Georgia Hohen, and she hired on Sandy as her assistant. And then when she retired, Sandy took over and hired me on and I played for Georgia and Sandy.

So there's a lot of ties. So I have the great fortune of actually having a relationship with all of those coaches that I mentioned that really laid the foundation for kind of what was important here at UC Davis. And there's a [00:17:00] legendary coach named Jim Soker, a football coach here. Who won 18 straight championships and is well known throughout the country for his very Just amazing coaching philosophy and I had the privilege of being mentored by him as well and kind of developing this idea of Aggie pride, which to everybody that has played at UC Davis, they have heard it, they have experienced it.

It might mean a little something different to everybody, but it's kind of this strong feeling of you know, every, every program kind of, you know, defines it just a little bit differently. So, so that was sort of taught to me as a player here. I got to hear from former coaches and, and then getting the chance to work with Sandy in my first, well, my second collegiate coaching experience was great because you know, I got to kind of see hands on what had made him successful.

And yet at the same time, like you said, I, was developing my own philosophy as a coach. And I think I [00:18:00] had the great fortune of working with him long enough that really I was able to you know, just to kind of understand he, he is, Sandy is a, is sort of, we do things the right way, you know.

There's, there's not a lot of gray. It's just, we do, you know, you'll always be okay if you do things the right way. And you know what, that might not always lead to a winning outcome or whatever that might be, but you're going to be able at the end of the day to, to feel good about yourself and your program.

And I think I had been around other, you know, just heard things from other people and programs about, Oh, well, you can kind of. Then the rules here, you know, and, and he was like, Nope, we don't do that. And so that was great for me as a young coach to say, okay, well, figure out who you are, but we're gonna, we're going to do things the right way.

And I think that's been really kind of great to have guiding us and our staff. And, and the other thing that I think I brought, you know, both as an assistant, but really when I became the head [00:19:00] coach and, and hire, you know, our staff, we had a couple of coaches that were, were here already. Some my husband, Joe, who's, who's on our staff too.

We sort of, he's our associate head coach. So we do make a lot of decisions together, but, but something that. That we felt really, really strong about was the fact that relationships are going to be at the foundation of our, our program. And I think that our culture really goes back to that. To me, you know, the strength of the relationships on the team are directly related to the success of the team.

And so I think that while I've always been a relationship, person. When I became the head coach, that became more of a philosophy. And so we started figuring out like, well, how do we become a program where the relationships are really, really strong? Because we can talk about it and we can say it's important, but if we're not teaching our players how to build relationships, if we're not showing them that we really are invested in them and, and want to build relationships with them, then [00:20:00] they're just words, right?

So, we, we really use a lot of team building within our program to, to kind of enhance those relationships and we, we enjoy getting creative and using fun ways to, to use team building and, yeah, I think, you know, we can go more into that, but, but I think that's kind of been one of the main Things that I've really tried to hone in on through the years and that really doesn't change for me.

When players come in here, they know, you know, I have players that's, you know, transfers that come in and say, Hey, I had, you know, two conversations with my head coach in two years and they're never going to feel like that here. The door's always open. They're going to know that. You know, I, I want to learn as much as possible about them and I want them to do that with everybody in the program.

So that's kind of things on the, the culture side of things. And then of course, basketball wise, you know, we kind of spun things a little bit in a different direction too. And, and just I think that's been an, you know, kind of an evolution through the years, figuring out you [00:21:00] know, how, as the game changes, how do we change and, and advance and, and constantly Challenge ourselves and grow and, and try to put the best most exciting team on the court each year.

Ross Romano: well, and certainly I think that's the uniqueness of having a, that lineage of coaching and a consistency and what the, the program is like, what this, what this forward at this school, or maybe it's across more sports represents is is a differentiator, right? Because there's a lot of. There's a lot of teams out there, a lot of universities, a lot of programs that, that athletes can choose to be a part of, right, and it's not just better or worse, you know, it's about fit, and it's about what, what one seems like the right program and, and and there's, it often does appear that when there's [00:22:00] universities that break from that, you know, when they have, you know, a coach who leads the next coach, et cetera.

And then they choose to go find somebody else, you know, maybe reacting to a few bad seasons or something. They end up wanting to, you know, regretting it and saying, okay, let's go find somebody who's been here before. And, and of course the division one level, there's a lot of pressure on that wins and losses and and, and that's a part of it.

But it does also seem that the best way to have success is to do it your own way, right? The way that it happens at your school with the things that you offer, right? And what attracts student athletes and coaches to that. Instead of just trying to do the same thing as everybody else and competing head to head in that way.

How does the admi yeah,

Jennifer Gross: oh go ahead, I was just going to say at the end of the day, whether it's a high [00:23:00] school, a college, or a professional athlete, like people want to know that You care about him, that you have a plan to help them develop because a lot of these players, they want to be great, you know, and all those other factors that we talked about earlier, that doesn't change that.

And so trying to really help them know that, you know, taking the time to get to know them, to feel them, to figure out how to best coach them. What are their goals? You know, what do they really want to accomplish? And then really developing a plan for that improvement, that can go a long way. And it really creates buy in.

And I think that's the key to sustain success is if you can get the buy in from everybody and you can really get everybody kind of moving in the right direction you can get better a lot faster.

Ross Romano: Yeah, yeah, and that evidence of progression and of development of people who have been in the program before you, right, is something that for the incoming [00:24:00] athlete or the person who's interested in going into coaching, right, can look at and say, okay, if I really want to go in that direction, And I come here and I put in the work and I do what I'm supposed to do.

And I developed the relationships and, you know, and I'm effective. I can have an opportunity because I can see that it has, that's the culture of the organization. And that's not unique to sports teams. That's all kinds of businesses and organizations where if you're, if you're looking at joining them and you can see, all right, I can see that.

People have been there for a long time and people have advanced into different roles. And when I'm talking to them about joining the organization, we're talking about growth and development and versus, I don't really see evidence of that, or I have no idea. It could certainly make the difference, I'm sure, to an assistant coach [00:25:00] to say, Okay, do I start to look to see if I can jump somewhere else and either become a head coach or become an assistant somewhere else?

Or do I believe that I'm in a good position here because this is a place that creates opportunities? And and, you know, and, and as far as when you talk about. For the university to sustain the program, that's important when you have talent you know, in house, you want to keep them there, but the way to keep people there is that they believe that they'll have opportunities to grow.

And, and so I was curious from that, like about the, the administration piece of that, I would imagine that again, as we mentioned, you know, especially over this past. 20 years of being at the division one level that a lot of programs, like, and a lot of administrations feel the pressure to change things when there's, okay, are we getting the results we want, or could we possibly get better results, more [00:26:00] wins if we made a change, or, oh, we had a year that was a little disappointing, or, you know, all the things and, and that they're feeling like, oh, there's a, You know, a predisposition to think that changing things.

equals better and, and versus saying, okay, we're going to stick with what we've built here and what we've established. And we're also going to be a supportive of that culture, right? And then, and our coaches are going to feel like they should continue to build. I wonder if there's anything from that perspective, cause that's, that has come up.

In the past here on the show, and as far as some lessons learned of the good and bad of, okay, I realized when I went from this job to this job that I no longer was on the same page with the administration and wasn't, you know, I, I ended up [00:27:00] not building what I wish I would have built because I felt like the pressure was coming in a different direction and that, that communication, that that understanding of we, we have a, you know, You know, a shared vision here as I imagine it must be quite important to continuing to build that.

Jennifer Gross: Yeah, absolutely. I've been really fortunate here at UC Davidson, and my career is probably unique, you know, I think, you know, we talk about the transfer portal for student athletes, but we also joke that there's a transfer portal for coaches, you know, because there's just so much shifting all the time, you know, it's just every year, one coach gets pulled here, and then all of a sudden it just starts this You know, it's all of a sudden coaches just are going everywhere.

So, I think for, for student athletes when they're choosing a program, it's sometimes hard because you don't know always am I going to be playing for this person or this assistant coach that I got really connected to or whatnot. So, yeah, and for me here. Being here [00:28:00] for 20 years is, is I think a little on the I'm a bit of an outlier.

And I think part of that is I, like you said, when I think when you introduced me that this is special to me, you know, I, as a, as a, As a high school player, kind of choosing where I wanted to go, I, I did pick UC Davis myself and, and played here. And I had a lot of friends that went to other programs that didn't necessarily have the best experience, you know, that ended up transferring or quitting or finishing up, but not really loving basketball anymore.

And I, I had a great experience, you know, I, I met lifelong friends and, and just enjoyed every moment of it. And so coming back to UC Davis, it was sort of this, privilege to try to continue that you know, try, try to create a culture where everybody that plays here at UC Davis does feel excited and happy and enjoying their experience.

And, you know, kind of feels like I did where, you know, After they finished up felt like, hey, that was [00:29:00] amazing. I wish I could do it all over again. That's kind of my mission. But you need support to do that. And so I've been really fortunate to have athletic directors that see how passionate I am about our program, how invested I am about our program.

And, you know, of course, you know, if you have success, you know, other schools might call. And I got some good advice over the years from some respected mentors of mine that kind of said, you know, you really have to make sure it's worth it because what you've got going there at UC Davis is a pretty good thing.

And the grass isn't always greener, you know, at some of these schools, they expect results really quickly. And you got to make sure if it's, if, if you're, you know, leaving for another opportunity that it's, it's going to be exactly what you're hoping it will be. So. I don't know, for, for me, it's just been, it's never about, been about trying to, you know, go to this level or that level.

It's just [00:30:00] trying to be the best I can where I am and to be able to have sustainable. Sustained success obviously has helped in terms of me feeling comfortable with my position here because I have a great administration that, that supports me and has given me, you know, the longevity to, to you know, a lengthy contract to be able to, to not worry about that.

So I'm a little bit I'm in a good, good spot in that sense, but yeah, I do think if you can, it's like anything, you know, if, if our players. See my vision and really see how I want to invest in them and help them. They're going to flourish if I have that relationship with my administration where they, you know, are constantly asking how they can support me and how much, you know, they value what we're doing.

Well, then I'm going to flourish. So I think it's really important. And again, it goes back to those relationships and it's two way, you know, do we, how much time do [00:31:00] we, do we put into that relationship where, you know, I can go to that person and experience that. Press some frustration, but also share in the joy of it all.

And I think when you have an open relationship with the admin you know, when you have people that, you know, support you and when you support them, then it's a, it's a much better environment to be in. (ad here)

Ross Romano: Yeah, so taking that The next step, you know, when you're in the recruiting process and you're, you know, you are looking for the, the student athletes who are going to come into your program generally, you know, of course, sometimes there's specifics around, we need a point guard or whatever, but, but what are you kind of looking for and, and how are you determining, like, You know, when you are defining what makes a good fit for your program, what are some of the factors that matter?

Jennifer Gross: Yeah, great question. So the first thing we see, of course, is their skill set on the basketball court. That's [00:32:00] kind of what's going to draw us in and, and kind of pique our interest. So, you know, while that's not the only thing, that is the first thing that we see. We're watching them play. We say, Oh, wow, that person does seem like, you know, they'd be a good fit with our system and what we do.

And so sticking with that in terms of the basketball piece, we really like to recruit players that are versatile and that can kind of do a lot of different things on the court we like to utilize that versatility in both our offense and our defense, so that's something that we look for but I'd say very quickly we go from do they have the appropriate skill set to are they the kind of person that we want in our program And I know there are programs that watch a player one time, call the kid on the phone, and offer them a scholarship.

And to me, I feel like, you know, I want to know everything about this person. This is somebody we're going to be spending every day with for the next four years, right? I, you know, and so, You know, when, when I speak with someone on the phone, I want to [00:33:00] know where, where, what's their passions, how, you know, do they love it or are they just kind of playing because maybe I'm pretty good at it.

And, you know, we want people that love it, want to be in the gym together and want, you know, kind of are really all in we talk to as many people as we can in the recruiting process. So, getting to know the, the, the student athlete is super important and developing a connection. And I think at the end of the day, they want that connection and want to know that they're going somewhere where they, they do have a connection with the coaches.

But I want to hear from, I want to get to know the family, the parents, you know, I think that not everybody really takes the time to, to get to know More people in their circle, you know, at the end of the day, I do think that the decision does come down to the student athlete and what they want.

But if the family and their parents support them in that decision and feel like it's a good decision, everybody's going to feel a lot better about it. So I want to give them access to me. I want the parents. [00:34:00] I want to have a relationship with the family as well. I want to talk to coaches, you know, the coaches will tell you, you know, that you can ask a lot of questions and things will come up that you never would have learned.

You know, if there's anybody else that we know that, is connected to this person. We want to, you know, teammates, some, maybe some of an alum that we have or something. So, so we, again, it comes down to that relational piece and is this person not only a good fit on the court, but are they going to be a great teammate?

You know, all it takes is one kid to kind of, destroy the chemistry on the team and, and to kind of make it a miserable experience for everybody. And so, you know, It can't be perfect, of course, but we really want to take the time to, to get to know people, and to make sure that the people that we're bringing in yes, we are all competitive, and, and winning is fun, and it enhances the experience, and so we want to have competitors in the program, but we want people that want to [00:35:00] experience it together.

Selflessness is one of our core values, and, you know, we want selfless players that, you know, that shows up. As a teammate, it also shows up on the court with our offense and our defense and kind of our style and how we play team basketball. We want people that are bought into that. So yeah, I think and what I tell our recruits is, look, we might take a little longer to offer someone because we're in the process of getting to know you.

But, but doesn't that make you feel good that we're doing that with everybody else too? So, you know, when you say yes to us that, that we've taken the time to kind of vet. People and that we're, you know, we're, we value high character people. So you're going to be surrounded by, by great people. And then the last thing is just academically, UC Davis is a really great school.

And so we want people that are motivated both academically and, and on the court.

Ross Romano: yeah, yeah, and one of the things from the student athlete's [00:36:00] perspective to be aware of there is, and I think the conscientious approach to really determining who are, who are the people that we really want to offer these scholarships because we We hope they'll accept that. We really want them to be part of that program.

And, and there's things as young athletes and their families are navigating the recruiting process that they have to learn about what's, you know, what, what is a, level of interest. What does it mean? What's a binding offer? What, you know, what are all these things mean? And that of course it can be exciting and flattering to have somebody make you an offer when they've only seen you one time, but you still have to kind of ascertain, okay, what does that mean?

And, and also from my perspective, where do I really want to be? I think one of the positives [00:37:00] of some of the new rules is, is creating more of a power balance between athletes and coaches and programs. It doesn't always necessarily play out beneficially because when you have power, right, you have to exercise it responsibly.

So, I'm sure there's been cases of student athletes who have. Chosen to transfer based on they were in a starter one year or something like that and have maybe regretted that decision. Right. And but at the same time, of course, if coaches always had freedom, then it's fair likewise. But that goes back to the program you build and understanding, okay, I kind of know what I'm coming to be a part of here.

And I know that. It's not all of a sudden just going to change into something completely different next year. And I know as you, you know, you mentioned players who will be great teammates [00:38:00] and just as Players come in with their individual skill set and capabilities and you help them develop into better players.

Same thing with, with culture things, right? Players have their certain predisposition to being a great teammate and then you also build team culture and do team building to hopefully make them even better teammates. What, what are some of the things that have worked for you in that regard with team building and, and, you know, once you find the, the right.

building blocks of culture in your student athletes then hopefully turning them into something even greater as a team.

Jennifer Gross: Yeah so I think you know, I think team building is just as important, if not more important than developing any other skills you know, defense, offense, whatever that may be, you know, we'll take time away from court time if we don't have it to make sure that we're investing in our team. And so, I kind of, I sort of, [00:39:00] break team building up into sort of like, You know, maybe like a team activity versus a team building.

And I know a lot of, a lot of programs do team activities. So, you know, maybe we're going to go to the Giants game together, or we're going to go out and have a team meal, or we're going to, you know, whatever that might be, and those are fun. And those are great. And it's good ways to hang out with the team versus, Team building, and that's kind of what we try to focus on.

We do the activities as well, but the team building, we, we have a purpose behind it. So, you know, our team building activity activities are always followed by a discussion of some sort that sort of leads back to something that's important to our team. So, You know, why do we do it? Like the first thing goes back to the first thing I mentioned, which was relationship building.

So I want our players to get to know each other on a deeper level. I want them to learn new things about each other that they might not, even, even people they're pretty good friends with, they might not know certain things about their background [00:40:00] or, you know, what that might be. And that really helps to build trust and respect which is, is important.

It's super important to have, to having a strong culture. Team building gives us an opportunity to define our core values. So a lot of the activities that we do are centered around some of our values. We try to get creative with that. For instance, we might. You know, come up with some kind of game.

We like to look at game shows, you know, pick a game show, whatever it might be. We could do Pictionary, whatever. Pick a, pick a value. So, for this particular activity, maybe we're focusing on communication. Maybe we're focusing on as I mentioned, selflessness or enthusiasm or whatever it might be whatever, you know, a group's core values are, it's really easy to tie it in, but somehow the clues that we use in the game are tied into that value, so.

You know, maybe, maybe they're playing charades and, you know, acting something out. And one of the clues has to do [00:41:00] with this value. And one of the clues has to do with that value. And maybe we challenge them even to take that clue and say, Hey, which value do you think it's tied to? And, and so that is a fun thing that we're doing together and it gets competitive and exciting.

And then at the end of it, we break up into groups and we say, okay, you know, if we're talking about selflessness. Talk about this quote that you just acted out this phrase, what, what does it mean to you? Go ahead and talk about it with your group. Now, how can you tie that back to our team? And, and then let's take it a step further and say, okay, now let's, let's expand the concept of selflessness and how do we, What, what are everybody now write down 10 acts of selflessness that you witnessed with on your team this week?

Okay, let's, let's go ahead and now take it a step further and now I'd like you to write down 10 acts of selflessness that you can commit to next week or whatever that might be. So. It gives us a chance to talk about what's important to us in a fun [00:42:00] way. It helps our players find their voice. You know, we have players that as freshmen I'll ask a question and they will not raise their hand, you know, but by their senior year they could be leading our team building sessions because they're that confident in The things they've learned and we've discussed over the years.

It gives us an opportunity to help, you know, them, figure out how to handle adversity and, and kind of arms them with tools, you know, we'll, we'll, we'll do problem solving activities and, and have them figure out how to work together, how to, you know, we, we always tie it back to something on the team. So I think all of those, you know, you can get super creative and, and use fun activities as ways to, to really build and enhance you know, the culture and the things that, that are important to you as a leader and important to your team. And I think it really, it helps gain buy in from the players. Like I said, we'll ask, you know, we'll have recruits come and be part of it because we want [00:43:00] them to see, hey, we do these things here and this is important to us and we want, you know, and our players will, like I said, they're leading the discussions half the time because they get so, it's, it becomes really important to them too.

So yeah, so, so those are some things we do during the preseason. We're doing it once a week. Without fail, we want to make sure that, that our players know that this is important. This is important to us. Sometimes it's a flop, you know, we'll, we'll think it's going to be a really fun activity and it falls flat, but for the most part, they give us some grace and understand that at the end of the day, we're just trying to strengthen our team.

So yeah, so those, the, the team building aspect, I think is maybe a little bit unique that we do that we find Hey, we'll, we'll be going through the season and we'll have, you know, maybe we're struggling with a little something and we realized, you know what? It's been a couple of weeks. We haven't done a team building.

Let's let's, let's maybe it's just a quick little something followed by a discussion and it kind of gets us back on track. So I think it can be really valuable.

Ross Romano: Excellent. Well, [00:44:00] Jennifer, there I feel like there's so many more things we could talk about, but you've already been so, generous with your time. So I, I kind of want to tie it together here and, and, you know, and we have a lot of coaches listening and I want to hear from you. I believe you're a. four time conference coach of the year.

So, and I'm sure that as you've gone about your career, you've continued to grow and develop yourself and learn new things and refine your practices and keep up to date as the sport has changed. What, what does your own growth look like? What, what are some of the things you like to do to continue with your own improvement and development?

Jennifer Gross: Yeah. I find that one of the most fun parts of the job. We're very lucky that we have so much at our fingertips these days. You know, we have a software where I can look up any, any team in the country and break down, you know, different parts of their offense or just watch. And so I try to make a list throughout the year when I'm watching games and I say, Oh, let's remember to go [00:45:00] back and watch Stanford's transition, you know, in this game or whatnot.

But it's so cool. You can literally just search for a team and pull up all their offensive possessions in a certain area and just watch. And so I love to do that. I look at who's successful, who's successful at the mid major level. Why are they successful? Let me watch and try to figure that out. I also learned early on that He, you know, people in this profession, and I think really in any profession, are so willing to help.

And you know, a perfect example of that is Tara Vanderveer, you know, just retired from Stanford after incredible Hall of Fame career. I mean, I could call her today and say, Hey, I'm kind of struggling with this situation. What do you think? She's so generous. And this is one of the winningest coaches of all time.

The winningest coach of all time, you know? So I think what I suggest is just, just reach out, you know, like I [00:46:00] am completely available. If anybody's listening and wants to shoot me an email and say, Hey, we'd love to jump on a call with you and learn a little bit more about. Some of the team building you do or the offense that you run or whatnot.

I, and I know that so many people are, are the same way, whether that's in coaching or, or whatever that may be, it might take, you know, 10 emails to get one or two responses, but those one or two are, are going to be tremendous resources for you. So, I reach out to my mentors. I try to have conversations with people.

I utilize the resource that, that we have with technology. I read you know, I listen to podcasts. There's just so many cool things out there where you can learn and, and it's, it's fun. It's interesting you take a tidbit from so many different people and I think that's you know, something that is important to us is that we're.

We're not, you know, in 20 years of coaching, we're not coaching the [00:47:00] same way every single year. You know, we want to make sure that each year is a new and, and better experience that, you know, we're challenging each other as a staff. I'm really fortunate. I work with an amazing staff. And I want them to come to me with ideas and say, Hey, let's get better at this.

And, and You know, I, I suggest for, for assistant coaches in particular be solution oriented. Everybody can point out problems. We all know areas that we struggle, but if we can have people around us and, and our, look to ourselves to be solution oriented and constantly try to find ways to be better.

to make it more fun for our student athletes. You know, this is college basketball, college sports is, yes, it's big business, and yes, we, we want to win, but at the end of the day, it should be fun. You know, we want to create a fun experience for our student athletes. And yes, winning is part of that, but how can we do that?

How can we be at our best? Well, there's, you know, all the things I mentioned are ways where we can challenge ourselves to [00:48:00] be better.

Ross Romano: Yeah, excellent. Well, listeners clip that part. There's a lot there to draw from as you know, sports change over time. Athletes change, right? You have to change with it and focus on those relationships, building something that. Players want to be a part of that, you know, and ultimately that takes putting in the effort to learn who those athletes are, what are the things that interest them, motivate them, what are the things we can do to build something that is attractive and is, you know, is valuable to our student athletes and our community.

So I hope you've taken a lot from this conversation. If you're listening, if you like this one I'm sure you'll like some of our other episodes, so please do subscribe to Sideline Sessions and we'll continue to bring you conversations with coaches from across the sporting landscape. Coach Jennifer Gross, thanks so much for being here.

Jennifer Gross: Thanks for having me, Ross. It was fun. [00:49:00]